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Consumer Reviews of HTP boilers

Popularity:
#50  of 67 brands of boilers

23% of customers recommend
2 of 5 stars 359 reviews

  • Very Satisfied
    70
  • Somewhat Satisfied
    15
  • Neutral
    94
  • Somewhat Unsatisfied
    9
  • Very Unsatisfied
    171

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Date created: 2011-02-07 Name: Dan Acevedo
Location: Elmwood Park,NJ

Satisfaction Rating:

5 of 5 stars Very Satisfied

Review:
"Good boiler"
Great boiler. Just needs to be set up properly. MUST perform a CO and CO2 adjustment and Pipe to Manufactures Specifications for proper operation.



Date created: 2011-02-05 Name: L Davis
Location: Hansville, Wa

Satisfaction Rating:

1 of 5 stars Very Unsatisfied

Review:
"Homeowner"
After the last 4 cold winters my very sporadic 2004 Munchkin boiler has finally been replaced by Munchkin with only a $410 install charge. We shall see....


Date created: 2011-02-04 Name: Homer
Location: Nevada

Satisfaction Rating:

3 of 5 stars Neutral

Review:
"Why Things Need Fixing"
Geoff Marshall- Little Deer Isle, ME-- Geoff, you write,"The point is, and the 'Munchkin defenders' seem to be oblivious, why do I have problems to fix?". My first typewriter was an Underwood. I typed on it in college, all I ever had to do was change ribbons. Next was a Smith-Corona electric, worked good but I had to change the belt. Then and IBM Selectric, novel, but I had to have it serviced in a shop. Now I type on a computer, fantastic, but I am growing old fixing it. (I'm a real computer Whiz Bang ) Complexity grows, just look at your car. The rule is--repairs (fixes) are directly proportional to complexity of what you're trying to fix. Boilers are really complex compared to the old days, there is a lot of complexity in the installation and system design now,too; but you know that. You're a pretty intelligent guy. I can tell that by the way you write your posts. You have already solved your problem with your 140M, "All the metal in the cabinet is corroded, but NOT from reversion--after firing, hot, wet air from the burner chamber rises up the fuel plenum, through the blower out the swirl plate and condenses on the freezing metal parts". I suggested, "increase the post purge on the blower to 100 sec." and other suggestions. I know that anyone who has attended the Vision 1 course is knowledgeable (I attended it 3 times + a Vision 2 and Vision 3 course, too), but I write not only to you but to the readers, too. They think that Vision 1 is 20-20 eyesight, not you, dear reader, but the other jokers reading these reviews), so I try to explain things for them, which is why I elaborate on the fault codes. My views on concentric venting is born out of experience and common sense. HTP may not have told you "not to use concentric venting", but remember that for years people were told that the earth was flat. I do not know which way the wind is blowing around your house, day to day, season to season, updrafts-down drafts, on and on. I would rather not chance reversion, so, I like separation. So, Geoff, how do you know that you didn't have a combination of gas reversion and contamination from the HX on the 140M? Also, I like to say that I meant to write 1500 ohms not 150 ohms on the outdoor reset sensors.--Lastly, one need only Ixquick (Google) New York Thermal, Inc. (NTI) Trinity boilers to read about the problems with that manufacturer. As I have said all manufacturers have their share of problems. I wish we didn't, but then I wouldn't be writing these post for you fine readers


Date created: 2011-02-03 Name: Homer
Location: Nevada

Satisfaction Rating:

5 of 5 stars Very Satisfied

Review:
"Reputable Installer"
Geoff Marshall- Little Deer Isle, ME--I can't help you with the coffee grounds, but I would like to know. Perhaps, flakes from the corroded aluminum inside the blower housing building up on the HX. I do know that HTP recommends tilting the unit toward the rear. My condensate flow goes through a clear vinyl tube to a neutralizer, so I can visually see the condensate as it leaves the boiler. I have a meter that test the PH and it is around 3.5, less than 7.0 is acidic. The code requirement is a 3/4" minimum drain pipe for the condensate piping. I have never had a problem with the condensate drain (plugging and backing up). What you say about the fuel plenum is the source of your problems, I bet. on Revision 2 the post purge is 100 sec. to clear the combustion chamber. (see my other posts) As you stated the blower is under the HX on the NTI Trinity and the fuel plenum acts as a thermal trap (hot gases rise), not so with the Munchkins and can be the source of the destructive exhaust getting into your blower and cabinet as you stated. You can check the post purge on the blower (see my earlier posts. The post purge can be changed by software to 100 sec. (revision 2 setting). Your post confirms my thoughts about this. I would certainly increase the post purge on the blower. In ME it gets mighty cold in the winter and you are pulling cold air into the cabinet, it seems to me that the boiler when it is running would condition the air to a more moderate temperature. I think that I would run your boiler with the cabinet cover partially open in the winter as long as the air in the boiler room is not contaminated with chlorine, phosphates or hydrocarbons. I never thought about Silicone, they do make a copper impregnated high temp (800 degrees) silicone. However you have to wait 24 hrs for silicone to cure (the only draw back?). The thermistors are probably manufactured with a 1-5% tolerance rating, so they can vary. I was thinking that maybe a 1/2 watt fixed resister of the correct ohm-age might correct that to the true outside temp. connected inline with the sensor wire. I might try that myself. However the thermistor is not linear. Right now, my D5 of the Status Menu on my 140M is 40 deg and my outdoor weather station is reporting 34 deg (same sunless side of the house). You can correct your central heating curve to take this into account, too. Since the sensor is mounted on the side of the house, it could be reading heat from the house through the wall whereas the station sensor is mounted on the eaves away from the wall, which may account for the discrepancy. I don't know it all, although my wife says that I am a big know it all. So, it's good that the readers provide their knowledgeable input (edukation is a good thing). SO, do a CO analysis and increase the post purge on the blower. Boy, I always harping on this CO analysis thing.


Date created: 2011-02-02 Name: Geoff Marshall
Location: Little Deer Isle, ME

Satisfaction Rating:

3 of 5 stars Neutral

Review:
"Thanks, Homer"
Thanks, Homer. It was just a review, didn't need advice (except about the 'coffee grounds'). I took the factory course. I know HOW to fix problems. The point is, and the 'Munchkin defenders' seem to be oblivious, why do I have problems to fix? The factory course wasn't tough and they didn't tell us not to use concentric vents (CV). And the 199 with the CV hasn't had the number of problems as the 149. All the fixes you give have been there from the start with the 149. Reversion: the in and out were widely separated with the exhaust sticking out about 18" further from the building; is is possible, but unlikely. Blowers: only the first blower had a disintegrating plastic fan (which appeared to have come apart at a glue joint); the others just 'died'. All the metal in the cabinet is corroded, but NOT from reversion--after firing, hot, wet air from the burner chamber rises up the fuel plenum, through the blower out the swirl plate and condenses on the freezing metal parts. HTP should have made this a sealed unit with a Honeywell valve like the Trinity. Condensate: I build a simple plywood support for the condensate drains out of the Munchkin so they don't kink. Gas piping: I request 1" or 1 1/4" from the meter and never step down until right at the unit. Pressure right on 13". Swirl plate comes with the Dungs valve. Burner tube gasket--use hi temp silicone--no more scorch marks on front refractory. We know what the error codes mean. You better start tilting your Munchkins toward the rear--read the new manual! Or open them up and put the level on the HX. The central heating curve problem is simply that sometimes it seems to calculate the wrong number in d11--not a big deal, but just another puzzler. My thermistors are like a few 1000 ohms away from where they should be, got a new one and put it in the freezer and checked against the chart in the Vision 1 manual. No good. I'm going to keep returning them until I get one that has correct resistance. Got ya with the 'coffee grounds' in the HX???


Date created: 2011-02-01 Name: John Romano
Location: Illinois

Satisfaction Rating:

1 of 5 stars Very Unsatisfied

Review:
"JUNK, don;t buy!!!"
Have had this piece of junk for 5 years. Every year there is some type of issue. Had the replace the blower unit because a plastic fan falling apart. The fan probably costs $5 but you have to buy the entire blower unit which is $700. The new unit has a metal fan. Now I am told that the computer board needs to be reprogrammed for the fan to run 90 seconds not 30. THe swirl plate is bad again. You will pay top dollar for this product and be a test bed for their enginering team. Don't count on getting any support from the company... they are just as bad as their product!


Date created: 2011-01-29 Name: Homer
Location: Nevada

Satisfaction Rating:

5 of 5 stars Very Satisfied

Review:
"Reputable Installer"
Geoff Marshall-- Little Deer Isle, ME--First of all, let me state again my aversion to concentric venting. I don't do it or recommend it. Putting the exhaust and intake so close together is asking for trouble. The plastic impeller in the blowers don't handle partially burned acidic hydrocarbon very well. The new 140 and 199 blowers have stainless impellers and it is about time. Plastic fatigues when rotating at 3200 rpm and I am sure that the stresses and acidic CO accelerate the disintegration of the plastic impeller. So try my odd ball, First Alert, Knight CO detector in your cabinet, idea (see earlier posts)and see if there is reversion. When ever you remove a malfunctioning blower, always open it up and examine the inside. If the aluminum inside is black and scaly and the impeller is rough, pitted and coming apart. You have gas reversion problem. Moist acidic exhaust inside the cabinet is bad news for electronics as acid compounds conduct electricity which can't be good for the ICs (Integrated Circuits) inside. I WILL MENTION THIS NOW, FOR THE FIRST TIME. I always install a high efficiency boiler with a computer grade 4200+ joules surge protector. Everything is run off of it, even pumps. If lighting or surges are common in your area, a whole house surge protection system is essential.---Ok I don't know when the trumpeting started on the 140M or what trumpeting sound like to you. But this can happen if you have a Dungs gas valve on instead of the old Honeywell gas valve. The swirl plate that is between the gas valve and the blower is made of Nylon (now nylon and aluminum) and if the vanes disintegrate as they will because of CO and or dust and dirt in the intake air, it will cause a vibrating sound. The swirl plate should always be inspected when replacing a Dungs gas valve. The Dungs gas valve doesn't use the cork gasket which is on the new blower and it should be removed when installing the swirl plate to the blower. All three components need to be tightly connected as one unit. Look thru the sight glass as the boiler is running does the flame pulsate with the trumpeting? Yes?, Check the swirl plate and check the input pressure on the gas valve. The gauge should be within 1/2" of water/column. Static pressure for NG is 7" W/C and propane 12-14" W/C. You must have a full 3/4" gas pipe into the Munchkin as the valve draws a vacuum on the gas line. The gas pipe from the meter with all it's tees and branch lines must be calculated properly for flow.-- The refractories will crack, the target more so. They are fragile. I always have an extra set on hand during cleaning the combustion chamber. I only clean the combustion chamber when needed, not twice a year. And I always replace the burner tube gasket and tighten the 4 screws with a socket wrench nice and tight. (the cause of many F09 error codes)(see my earlier posts) F10 ERROR CODES--F10 is indicative of a flame failure while the Munchkin is running. FIRST-check that the condensate drain is clear and flowing freely. Condensate back-ups create steam which suffocates the flame, throws off rectification, soaks the refractory plates, causing the spark to ground out. SECOND-check the flame rod by depressing and holding the S4 button on the control module, the display should read D1. press and release the button till D7 appears. D7 reading should be as close to 4.1 micro amps as possible even tho it may be a little low at starting but go up to 4.0 when running. The reading is directly related to the CO output of the boiler. Tighten the 4 bolts on the burner tube. F11 ERROR CODES--Flame rod sees flame when there is no actual flame. Check wiring to the gas valve (clean and jacks & plugs with a computer grade electronic cleaner). This can happen when the boiler is short cycling and the combustion chamber is super heated. Check for a blocked flue. The exhaust vent should be pitched 1/4" per foot back to the boiler. Make sure your not venting too long a length. Always check your wiring harnesses. I have never had a problem with the condensate if the case is level. I always mount my Munchkins on a metal stand 18" off the floor with a platform that is level both ways. YES--there is some variation with the outdoor reset temperature reading. I've placed 4 (vision 1) thermistors side by side in cold weather and they have varied one from another by 150 ohms or so. I don't quite understand what you are trying to say a far as your "Central Heating Curve" goes. As far as granular debris in the combustion chamber, I don't know. Cleaning HX coils after 3 yrs, the deposits were what you would see on automobile spark plugs with a properly tuned engine, that is my experience. Nothing like you're are describing . Hope this helps. P.S. You need a Combustion Analyzer, folks.


Date created: 2011-01-29 Name: Geoff Marshall
Location: Little Deer Isle, ME

Satisfaction Rating:

3 of 5 stars Neutral

Review:
"A tale of two Munchkins"
I have two Munchkins. A 140 at home and a 199 at a summer rental property. Both units installed in spring/summer 2005. I travelled to the HTP factory in MA and took the Vision course in order to purchase these units and followed all the instructions to the letter. The 199, which uses a concentric vent, is running better than the 140 at my house which started out with two separate pipes through the wall. Four months ago I changed the 140 to use a concentric vent. The 140 at home has been a bear. Excessive trumpeting resulted in me buying a new gas valve and manometer and combustion analyser. Spent literally DAYS dialing the unit in and finally found some settings where the trumpeting was eliminated but could never get the high and low firing specs in order--close but no cigar. Then a couple of months later, the blower (#1), which always made a lot of noise at post purge disintegrated. The new blower had a metal, instead of plastic, fan, so obviously EBM (the blower manufacturer) saw there was a problem with the fan. Blower (#2) lasted approx 6 months. I managed to get warranty satisfaction through calls to HTP and FW Webb, my supplier and Emmerson, FW Webb's supplier. If you're counting, I'm on blower #3 and it is quiet and works well. I have also had to replace both the burner refractory and target refractory as they were cracked up and disintegrating. This unit has also had numerous F09, F10 and F11 lockouts. I take it apart and clean it twice a year. During a service while rinsing (yes I remove the target refractory when cleaning), I noticed that the water level at the front of the heat exchanger (HX) was higher than at the rear, so I put the level IN the burner chamber. The HX itself was racked with respect to the blow-molded case so I had to shim the Munchkin to achieve a level HX. I see there is now a 'Rev 2' installation manual for the Munchkin that says the unit should be tilted back toward the condensate drain. When I took the Vision 1 class, we were told level and put the level on the blow-molded case. How many installers actually take the unit apart and check the drainage? Then there is the outdoor reset. I noticed that the d5 status was showing an incorrect outdoor temperature. I replaced the outdoor sensor to no avail. Also the programmed outdoor reset curve doesn't seem to work as stated. I set my slope at 1.0 (from 110@35 to 165@-20) just to check its operation and at d5 reporting 32 degrees my calcutated setpoint should be 110 + 3 but Munchkin reported d11 status as 115. On the other hand, the 199 has worked quite well and been nice and quiet. Only on the second blower, It started locking out with F11's, but cleaning the rectifier seems to have solved the problem. IMHO a boiler should not lock out. I have had to buy a freeze alarm for the rental to alert me when the boiler is no longer working. At cleaning, both units have a fair amount of granular debris in the HX. My stepfather had a NTI Trinity installed, which is basically the guts of the Munchkin flipped over with the blower beneath the burner and a different computer. His HX is totally clean. We both use the same propane gas delivered from the same propane truck. In my area there is not a single installer or gas guy that has a combustion analyser which makes getting help from HTP tough because their first question is always, "What are your combustion levels?" I do not know ANYBODY here in Maine that can tell me their central heat boiler locked out the other day and all they had to do was hit the RESET button. So that's my story with almost no opinion thrown in. What would you buy for $3800? Why is the Trinity and Vitodens, which are almost identical units, so much more reliable?


Date created: 2011-01-27 Name: Homer
Location: Nevada

Satisfaction Rating:

5 of 5 stars Very Satisfied

Review:
"Reputable Installer"
Tim H.-New Hampshire--Tim, do you mean to tell me that in 7 yrs. you replaced 4 boilers (units)? If that's true, the odds of that happening are astounding. It would be easier to win the Powerball Lottery. What this tells me is that you got an installation, system or gas reversion problem that has never been addressed. I'm assuming that you mean something else? If your last boiler was 3 1/2 yrs old, you more than likely have Honeywell gas valve and not a Dungs gas valve on it. Gas reversion will do a number on the electronics, wiring, blower and 3 1/2 years is about how long it takes for the damage to surface. Honeywell gas valves need a reducing disk installed when using propane gas. There is more going on here than meets the eye. Also everyone, when posting, PLEASE, state model #, gas type, FAULT CODES, and date of installation. Just don't rile against Munchkin, although you can do that too. Venting your feelings helps you , but doesn't help the reader understand what is going on. Give the readers more information about your experience so that the reader can render an informed judgment about your situation.


Date created: 2011-01-26 Name: Tim H.
Location: New Hampshire

Satisfaction Rating:

1 of 5 stars Very Unsatisfied

Review:
"I'm tearing it out this spring"
I have a Munchin 140, Like the vast majority of the other reviews this boiler has been a total disapointment since it was installed 7 or eight years ago. I am on the 4th unit now the first years with this piece of junk were filled with constant failures, new replacement units and I can't count the number of call backs. The 4th unit was installed about 3 1/2 years ago and was working okay until this past weekend when the gas valve failed. It was the coldest weather we've had in years 10 to 15 below zero. Parts are not readily availble, had to UPS them in. 4 days without heat. The design is terrible. You can't get to the condensate line to clean it because it's underneath the unit. The process they recommend to clear it is so involved that it boarders just plain stupid. The control panel was an obvious afterthough and is not integral to the cabinet. The control wiring connects to the board inside the the. It then has to be draped over the side of the unit to get it outside to where the control panel attaches to the side with velcro. Plenty of other design flaws but not enough room here to descibe them. Told my wife when the weather breaks this spring I'm replacing it with something more reliable, and I'm crossing my fingers that it will last till spring.

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