Consumer Reviews of Heat Transfer Products boilers

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Date created: 2012-01-13 Name: Shannon
Location: Levering, Michigan
Years owned: 7

Satisfaction Rating:
Review:
"F09 - ANY SOLUTIONS?"
We installed this Munchkin in our new foam-block home 7 years ago. When it is installed properly and running properly, you can save substantial amounts of money on heating costs, as well as enjoy a comfortable even heat. However, in the past year, we have put a substantial amount of money into the Munchkin itself, replacing parts in hopes to discover exactly why it keeps malfunctioning. Currently, tonight, I sit in my 65 degree home, which has been without heat for approx. 18 hours and it is currently 20 degrees outside, so by morning - well, it won't be so cozy. My hvac professional (licensed owner) is completely stumped by a f09 code. We push the reset button, the flame ignites and the unit runs for approximately 15 minutes to a temp of 117-120. The flame then goes out and the unit tries to reignite, but of course after 3 attempts, f09 - errors out. If you try to reset it again immediately, it won't ignite. But if you wait a few minutes, it will ignite on the first try and repeat the same cycle. It has been 3 months since a thorough cleaning and a new flame sensor being installed. Today, we emptied the condensate drain and cleaned the flame sensor, but to no avail, I sit with my children on the coldest night of the winter without heat. This is the fourth time we have had to work through a trial and error method to fix our Munchkin within the year. However, in a 4200 square ft. home, we haven't filled our 1000 gallon propane tank since May 2011. We are rapidly loosing faith in the Munchkin brand, especially since tonight this is the only place I have been able to feel hope that someone would respond to this review with some insight to solving our problem with a long term solution. There is no website that offers any support, nor an 800 number for Customer Service that exists that I have found for these Munchkin boilers. And, at least where we reside, only a couple know and/ or understand the complete concept and mechanics of the boiler system. Since we made the investment and appreciate the ability this unit has to heat our home, we are open to any suggestions for a resolution to this problem. Unfortunately, if a solution is not found, a Munchkin is not what we will purchase ever again. Any guidance from those of you that are firm Munchkin believers would be greatly appreciated.

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Date created: 2012-01-04 Name: Homer
Location: Nevada
Years owned: 7

Satisfaction Rating:
Review:
"NC Fault Code"
Stephan Wilkinson--Cornwall-on-Hudson,NY nc Fault Code means this: Improper neutral (white wire) connection to the boiler. Make sure that the ground (green wire) hasn't any stray current (ground fault) on it. You should check the wiring on the boiler junction box and wall cord that plugs into the wall outlet for proper polarity. You can buy a cheap wall outlet tester at Home Depot and plug it in and it will tell you if the outlet box is wired correctly (polarity wise). On the cord, one side is ribbed and one side is smooth. The ribbed side is the white wire and the smooth side of the cord is the black wire. The green wire is ground. The ribbed side should be connected to the white wires in the boilers junction box and the smooth side should be connected to the black wires in the boiler junction box.

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Date created: 2011-12-30 Name: Homer
Location: Nevada
Years owned: 7

Satisfaction Rating:
Review:
"Happy New Year--A rockin'-n-rollin'"
Jesse, barton, VT---Contenders are good boilers, an improvement on the Munchkin. So your boiler's a rockin'-n-rollin'. First, I believe that you have flashing in the hx (heat exchanger). Flashing occurs when the water pumped through the hx is too slow. (Gallons per minute). The water boils in the hx and vapors form and then collapse. It shakes the boiler. Not good! A 140m (140,000 btu) Munchkin should have 14 gpm pumping through the hx. 1gal for every 10,000 btu. To have such a high flow rate it is necessary to have a boiler loop and a heating loop (two pumps minimum) with the correct piping sized for flow. The pumps must be sized for system pressure loss (head) and flow, too. Pumps that are too small aren't going to get the job done. I have also seen this happen, but not as bad, when the gas valve is not correctly adjusted and also a blower problem. Second, Jesse, hire some one who knows what they're doing An F05 will shake the boiler (read earlier posts)and check the voltage at the pump (110V) when the boiler is running and acting up. Is the boiler pump turning? You need someone who's knowledgeable in Hydronics. It is a specialized field with a lot of training. So--do your guys qualify? Hope thing work out for you. Happy New Year, one and all!

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Date created: 2011-12-29 Name: jesse
Location: barton, VT
Years owned: 2

Satisfaction Rating:
Review:
"contender"
Junk, Lemmon! Terrible machine. Falt codes all the time, almost shakes itself apart. So bad my heating company replaced it with a new one because they couldn't get the first one to run correctly. This second machine is just as bad. Shakes and falts out every week!

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Date created: 2011-12-25 Name: Homer
Location: Nevada
Years owned: 7

Satisfaction Rating:
Review:
"Merry Christmas--This year in review !!!"
I hope that all you Munchkin owners are warm and cozy this Christmas season; I know I am, of course my Munchkin was installed by a trained professional--me. Sorry, I really am here to help, dear readers. Rather than ranting about the product, seeking a solution for your problem might be a better course of action, don't you think? There are plenty of tips in these posts, so read them. ---wayne hoefler, Cripple Creek,CO-- There is no adjustment for High Altitude except a combustion analysis with a recently calibrated meter. --hl bent and steve of BeltLine Heating-- Kudos to you. --mark, Derry,NH--I can hardly believe that the Munchkin is responsible for your pumps failing(I'd like to hear about that, I'm always willing to learn). $2000 for a repair and circulators seems way over the top. PS-Use Grundfos pumps which can be taken apart and cleaned rather than Taco pumps --important--b nordt, Virginia--Your gas valve is incorrectly set and allowing too much gas into the combustion chamber. Do a combustion analysis and check your gas supply pressure. I've seen this happen for those reasons. --vicki allison, Cape May, nj--whoa babe, Two control boards??? And your techie says that there aren't and faults on the display, so you need a new board for $1000 smackers. You have just encountered the dreaded parts changer (see earlier posts). Did he hook up his laptop computer to the control board and look at the fault history? Duh! F03 is a fault with the return (water coming back to the boiler) sensor (thermistor, a temperature variable resistor). You would disconnect the wires and measure the resistance on the sensor and check the temperature gauge and look at the chart in the installation manual and see if your resistance measurements, relatively, corresponds to the temperature on the gauge. If so look some where else for the problem. like the harness! Read my earlier post on f05 problems and tinning the Molex connectors. I sure the first technician was working for his ged. PS-There were some problems with the molex connectors.-- c m, Vancouver, Canada--I like Triangle Tube boilers. They're a different design. Munchkins are a low mass, high head boiler and Triangle Tube is a medium mass, low head boiler. Mass is the amount of water in the hx and head is the pressure needed to push water through the hx at a given gallons per minute. All boilers need maintenance and cleaning. Reminds me of the story of a world traveler in the 1800 talking to a Texan and describing a giraffe. After a bit, the Texan look at him and said, "There ain't no such animal". A self cleaning hx? There ain't no such animal. Ever hear of a self cleaning spark plug for you car? Didn't think so. As for your boilers, you have installation problems, me thinketh. --margie b, Dayton, Ky--The failure in the easier blowers was that the plastic impellers came apart. The new replacements have metal impellers. Don't let a boiler guy replace the blower with an plastic version. Take the old one apart and check the impeller for damage, if none check the control board and wiring harness. I don't think that your model has a negative pressure switch proving the blower is blowing. Also, have your boiler guy increase the blower post purge to 100 sec from 25 sec. You need a laptop computer, control board to computer harness, and htp program to do this. This important for short exhaust vent lengths.--KIM, Greenfield Center NY--I've covered f09 error code and their causes in previous posts. foo error code is a thermostat polarity connection problem with two causes: polarity of the two gray tt wires connected to the control board or a grounding of the gray tt wires or the grounding of the thermostat wires connected between the thermostat and gray tt wire. The polarity problem: disconnect the two gray tt wires from the thermostat wires and twist the two gray tt wires together and reset the boiler and that should fix that. Check to make sure none of the wires are grounded to anything metal. If you are using a current robbing thermostat replace it. I like White/Rogers(Emerson) thermostats 1f89-344 or similar types. --G. brown, Edmond, Oklahoma--You have an installation problem. Betcha, Betcha, Betcha Happy New Years to all you dear readers and may your house be blessed with warmth and happiness. If not your house, then, surely, your heart. That's pretty much a wrap for 2011.

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Date created: 2011-12-17 Name: Wayne Hoefler
Location: cripple creek colorado
Years owned: 9

Satisfaction Rating:
Review:
"High Altitude Conversion"
Stay tuned doing a high altitude conversion to my 199m after a flawless 9 years of operation at 10,000 Feet I purchased the boiler over the internet intended for sea level operation pre set at the factory and installing the unit myslef no experience other following the instruction intallation manuel for the install. never had it tuned or cleaned or tilited 3/8 of an inch backwards to help it drain. I recieved an f-09 code after my mom crushed the garden hose of two feet to the drain and the unit flooded leaked from the front burner gasket indication its drain system was clogged. Odered new controller 926 board and display to make more efficent and for the dual sensoring of flame and the better program design, a 9 pin ribbon cable to accomodate the Hot igniter and of course having the the board reprogamed before delivery. Then talking with tech support HTP switching the location of the flame detector and ingniter for HA op's order new target wall and burner wall refrac. Doing the cleaning myself and tilting the unit and having a tech tune the unit I will follow up this post in one week. 4700 squre feet house minus 10F most of the winter Natural gas bill only $180.00 during winter for a bed and breakfast and using it to heat a Bac 80 gallon indirect tank for DHW looking for the new bill in January Cripple Creek Colorado 80813

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Date created: 2011-12-08 Name: HL Bent
Location: MD

Satisfaction Rating:
Review:
"Reality"
I was trained and taught to service Munchkin. I have a mastergasfitters license, master plumbers and master hvac. I even have a conversion burner gas license. I have found in over thirty years of service the simplest systems work best because simple people are more plentiful than complicated people and complicated stuff. Could it be that the majority of people refuse to invest in $1,500.00 analyzers and thousands of dollars of special instruments to actually do their jobs? Could it be they stop investing in education to stay current? I love the kiss method, but I have also found technology gives us more options. The trick is to embrace it and use it properly and hire people who know what to do. All products from the simple to the complex have problems. All maufacturers have had lemons in design and in units. But the first step is in the installer. Not all products can be applied everywhere. Choose wisely. Two, most installers barely have a high school education and it each day goes by they get more stupid as they do not train and educate. The consumer often gets the raw deal, because these people blame anybody, anything but themselves for the problems they face. When we blame the wrong thing we fail to work on the real problem. I can make a bad product look good or a good product look bad. What I can't do is get people to make better choices on who they hire because they are often too lazy to shop properly. You can't hire talent on low price and no background checking. If all you want is someone to light a wood log, you might just succeed with anybody, but in the area of combustion and today's technology that has been forced upon us with government standards and high cost of fuel and poor building designs, you have to hire experts. Without fail, every job I have gone on with a problem, had 3 issues. the part that failed, the thing that caused it to fail and lack of maintenance. I am not a fan of munchkin because it is complex and requires special training and tools, but don't most automobiles fit that same category? And I buy both. Heck, my whole industry now requires the equivalent of a college graduate to qualify for the work we have to do. If I have a choice I look for simple product that best fits my need and apply it properly. This alone eliminates 90% of service problems. Installation is the 100% most important part after the sale. It is here a 1/4" off level or a wire not tight, or some lack of knowledge, integrity and persistence to make it right ruins the project. And then even if it is perfect, we begin to use it and wear it out. Maintenance proper and complete at the full price required gives the consumer the best chance of having a good experience. If you can't afford the maintenance, you can't afford to own it. And yes even the best and simplest can be complicated by improper use of a thing. So I believe it when some people call this product junk and some call it great. I usually find the "junk" is a result of an incorrect choice, improperly applied, installed, used or serviced. It are these facts I have based and built my business on and why I call the plumbing heating and cooling fields recession proof. Good luck to all. Thanks to all who provide positive helpful comments. We all need to hear them all good and bad.

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Date created: 2011-12-07 Name: Mark
Location: Derry, NH
Years owned: 5

Satisfaction Rating:
Review:
"Cross Your Fingers If You Bought One"
I just got a $2000 repair bill for 2 circulators and a mother board. I have a oil burner in my other house for 20 years and the circulators are still running. Oh My God

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Date created: 2011-11-25 Name: Steven Whitbeck - BELTLINE HEATING
Location: Grand Rapids MI.

Satisfaction Rating:
Review:
"GOOD boiler if installed properly"
99% of your problems are totally related to the way your boiler was installed. I install high efficient boilers for a living and have many Munchkin boilers installed that need no more than yearly maintenance. If they are not properly installed you will have a nightmare of problems. I installed a T80 in my 1512 square foot barn three years ago and did NOT dial it in or do anything other than hook up the water, gas, vent piping and electrical. This boiler has run flawlessly for three winters. I just recently checked the flame sense and found that it was getting close to lock out (F09). I did a before and after combustion analysis. There was a light coating of (coffee grounds) covering most of the heat exchanger. I cleaned this out with a vacuum and then brass wire brushed the heat exchanger then used a feeler gauge between the tubes. I then water washed the heat exchanger and flushed the drains. I found the flame rod was too far from the burner and the gap of the igniters was at 3/16 instead of 1/4 inch. The difference of the before and after was only 1% loss of efficiency with the water inlet and outlet temperatures the same on both tests. The only difference was the exhaust temperature was 5* higher in the dirty test due to the dirty heat exchanger. These boilers if installed properly will not be a problem. So ALL of you that are complaining need to have someone competent reinstall your boiler.

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Date created: 2011-11-21 Name: B Nordt
Location: virginia
Years owned: 4

Satisfaction Rating:
Review:
"my munchkin blows up!"
Disastrous... Every so often my munchkin boiler emits a kaboom that will rattle a 3 story house and almost flip you out of your bed. Had all kinds of repairs and the problem persists. This is a dangerous product.

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